Actor/director Delroy Lindo.DELROY LINDO’S RAGTIME
By
Alex Simon
Editor’s Note: This article originally appeared in the July 2005 issue of Venice Magazine.
Delroy Lindo initially made his name as a stage actor, starring in the Broadway hits Master Harold and the Boys (with James Earl Jones) and Joe Turner’s Come and Gone, which earned him a Tony nomination. Born in London November 18, 1952 the son of Jamaican immigrants, Delroy Lindo knew from the time he was a small boy that he wanted to act. After emigrating to the United States in the 1970s, Delroy studied and graduated from the prestigious American Conservatory Theater (ACT) in San Francisco, making his screen debut in More American Graffitti (1979) soon after. Delroy continued to work steadily on stage and then in film through the late 80s and early 90s, then gained wide recognition for his turn as crime boss West Indian Archie in Spike Lee’s Malcolm X (1992).
Since that time, Delroy Lindo has remained one of America’s busiest, and most versatile, actors, appearing in Spike Lee’s Crooklyn (1994) and Clockers (1995), Taylor Hackford’s Blood In Blood Out (1993), Barry Sonnefeld’s Get Shorty (1995), and Ron Howard’s Ransom (1996). Delroy gave a brilliant turn as legendary Negro League baseball star Satchell Paige in the HBO docudrama The Soul of the Game (1996), which remains one of his favorite roles and films, and scored big with his role in Lasse Hallstrom’s The Cider House Rules (1999) as Mr. Rose. It was on the set of Cider House that Delroy struck up a friendship with one of his co-stars, the rapper-turned-actor Heavy D (Dwight Myers). Heavy mentioned a play to Delroy called Medal of Honor Rag that he wanted to mount as a starring vehicle for himself, and inquired if the veteran actor would like to try his hand at directing. Now, six years later, Delroy Lindo makes his directing debut with Tom Cole’s Vietnam era play, starring Heavy D as D.J. Jackson, a decorated Vietnam veteran who, after winning the Congressional Medal of Honor, finds himself in a V.A. Hospital suffering from post-traumatic stress syndrome. As he tries to exorcise his demons with the help of a sympathetic psychiatrist (Paul Shackman), both men uncover truths about themselves. Medal of Honor Rag runs at The Egyptian Arena Theater through July 17.
Delroy Lindo sat down with us to discuss his career, and his directing debut.
How did the play come to you?
Delroy Lindo: Very simple: Dwight (Heavy D) asked me a couple years ago if I’d be interested in directing him in it. I knew the title, but I hadn’t read the play. After I read it, I was on the fence. I was trying to urge him to do something else, but he felt very strongly about it. Off and on during the last couple years, we’ve talked about it, and I finally decided to say ‘yes.’
While I was watching it, I was thinking how this play, which was written in ’76 and takes place in ’71, is so relevant today. Whereas prior to our going to Iraq for the second time, it might have felt dated.
Exactly right. That was part of my concern initially when he first sent it to me, pre-Iraq. I thought maybe we could make the character a Gulf veteran, to make it more contemporary.
There’s a reason that Johnny Got His Gun, set in WW I, was one of the best selling books during Vietnam.
Exactly. Exactly right, yeah.
What do you think some of the parallels are between what we’re going through now, and what soldiers in Vietnam went through.
While there may not be the lack of appreciation for the effort, I think a lot of the problems readjusting to society still exist. I think there is a very definite…I don’t know if the military has their head in the sand, but it seems like veterans continue not to be supported by the military, both in the commitment they make to go to war, and how they and their families are supported, and how they are supported when they come back. So I think that is still very, very much still an issue. When it came out a few weeks ago that this guy Pat Tillman was killed by friendly fire, and how the military manipulated that, and now his family is furious. That kind of subterfuge and lack of forthrightness in the face of people making extraordinary commitments to fight for this country, is immoral. So from that standpoint, I think those issues are still very pertinent, and what makes this play still relevant today.
I also think soldiers today share a lack of clarity with their brothers who were in Vietnam, in terms of why they are fighting there in the first place. Heavy D’s character even talks about this in the play. Vietnam, and Korea, and now Iraq, lacked the clarity and sense of purpose that WW I and II had.
That’s right. And also one of the things I’m really aware of, from a class and racial point of view, most of the soldiers are of color, working class, or even poor, who don’t have any other options, and it gives the feeling of it being a set-up that much more acute. It’s tragic all the way around, as far as I’m concerned: why this country went to war in the first place, and why these kids are over there fighting—for what? If you take the oil out of the equation, then what? And the fact that the kind of…the word that comes to mind is brainwashing, that these young kids are subjected to, in order to validate them going over there to put their lives on the line, is absolutely and aberration. It’s sickening.
It’s not just they who are brainwashed, most of the country is brainwashed. Look how most of them voted in the last election.
Absolutely. It’s difficult to get accurate information. And one of the things that is so disgusting, is that after 9-11, the way this country came together, and had genuine feelings of support for one another, that has been bastardized, as far as I’m concerned.
Tell us about Heavy D. He really showed off his acting chops in this role—very understated.
When you see him, tell him that! (laughs) One of the things I have been stressing with him, is less is more. Especially in the passages in which he has to express deep pain and anguish. He does trust me, but anytime that is affirmed, I like him to hear it. This is only the second time he’s been on stage as an actor in his life, so it’s been a steep learning curve for him, as it has been for me, as a director. But I really respect his ambition, his desire to get onstage in the first place. I think people will admire the effort, the commitment to get onstage and present himself in this way is incredibly admirable. Plus, it’s a very challenging piece of material, on many levels.
The actor who plays the psychiatrist, Paul Shackman, also did a wonderful job. They play off each other very well. He was also very restrained, which I liked.
Again, I hope he hears this. This is a deeply principled and passionate individual. One of the concerns Paul had was being too big. I’ve been encouraging him, though, to tap into the deep seeded passion that his character has. I’m very proud of the work that both of them have done.
It reminded me a lot, structurally, of Peter Shaffer’s Equus.
Yes, inasmuch as the character of the psychiatrist is administering help to his patient, he is able to uncover certain issues having to do with himself, which is very much the case with this play, although I think it’s much more subtle here. In Equus, it’s much more pronounced. Again, it’s a challenge from the point of view of the writing, but from a humanistic standpoint, it’s necessary to explore that element to make the play that much more compelling for the audience.
How was it going back to your roots in the theater?
I love the theater, so it’s been great. It’s been a real learning process for me, but hopefully one learns the lessons that one needs to learn, but in general it’s been a good time, a challenging time, but a good time.
Do you think actors have a different insight into directing that just straight directors do?
No question. No question.
You worked with one director previously who used to be an actor—Ron Howard. Did you take anything from your experience working with him?
Not consciously, but what I can say about Ron is that he runs an extremely well-ordered set. And I saw when I was working with Ron, the benefits of that, because everything emanates down from the director. And believe it or not, I was less conscious of that than I should have been in undertaking a project like this. But what was interesting in working with Ron Howard was even though that film was so tough and stark, the set was so well-ordered and so easy to be on, it made it very easy for the actors and the crew to do their work. So what I am very aware of from that is that whatever energy I bring to a project, will filter down and affect the entire work process.
Let’s talk about your background a bit. You were born in England, and your parents were Jamaican.
That’s correct: my family’s Jamaican. My Moms was part of the generation that emigrated from the Caribbean to England, Canada, or the United States. My Moms eventually wound in up Toronto, and I wound up in New York. I’m an only child. Then I went to San Francisco to study acting.
We have that in common. It seems to foster creativity, doesn’t it?
You think so? That’s interesting. I have a son who’s about to turn four, and I’ve always said that I prefer not to have an only child, but who knows if he’ll wind up being an only. But do you really think we wind up being more creative?
Absolutely. We have to entertain ourselves, which develops your imagination as well as a certain degree of self-reliance, which you have to have as an artist.
Yeah, that’s fair enough.
When did you discover acting?
When I was five years old, in elementary school, I was one of the kings in the Nativity play. I really believe that’s when the seed was planted. As far back as I can remember, I wanted to be an actor when I grew up.
You paid a lot of dues with some small roles in films and some major roles on stage before hitting paydirt with the part of West Indian Archie in Spike Lee’s Malcolm X in 1992. Archie was a really fascinating character, very complex.
That part will always have a special place in my heart for a number of reasons: first, I’m just super proud of that film. I think it was just wonderful work across the board in that film. Also, it was an important film, one that we were all very proud to be a part of. And then it wound up being such a good film. Truly, all of our hearts and souls were in that film. Even though I’m only in the film for ten minutes or so, the effect and the response to my work was wonderful.
Is it fair to say that role made your career?
It’s certainly fair to say that role put me on the map as a film actor.
That’s the first of three films you did with Spike. Tell us about him.
Spike has the gift of casting his films very well. He has a very strong sense of what he wants to achieve in his work. I always had the impression that Spike had a regard for me as an actor, which was very affirming, and that affirmation was a big part of what caused me to work the way that I did in his films.
You worked with Taylor Hackford in Blood In Blood Out aka Bound By Honor, which was a very overlooked film and, I thought, quite epic in its scope.
We were filming in San Quentin for a month, and it’s an experience I still have not sort of disseminated for myself. It was jarring and even though I had very strong responses to the environment, to the people, to the whole thing, it’s kind of impacted. What I remember becoming acutely aware of when I was working in San Quentin, was that the aspect of rehabilitation being almost non-existent in that system, and I had a number of conversations with guards and inmates about that very thing. One of the things I remember being told at that time was that the recidivism rate was 85-90%. You hear this and become very aware that many of the young men, the vast majority of whom are black and brown, leave those institutions completely ill-equipped to re-assimilate themselves back into society and all they know how to do is be in a penitentiary. And what’s tragic, is that the paradox is that a lot of these young men come out and consciously commit crimes so they’ll be sent back in, because being in jail is the only thing they know how to do. It’s structured so they won’t be able to function in society, so what are their alternatives?
Right, their free will is taken away from them because someone else makes all their decisions for them.
Right, and the only way they can think is inside that paradigm, that structure. I met so many young men who had incredible minds, minds that could have been put to positive use if they could just learn to refocus themselves.
Let me ask you: did you grow up poor?
Yes.
How did you avoid a life of crime?
I was smart. I was always good in school and I liked school.
So you had encouragement, then.
I did. That’s a very interesting question. I remember when we did Clockers, at the press junket we got into a conversation with the journalists about the relationship between the Rodneys of the world, my character in the film, who have the kind of influence over the young kids that they have. From there the conversation went to how do you sidestep those kinds of influences and how do you make a life for yourself. I think I managed to sidestep the streets because of two things: education was one of them, and I always had this notion that there was something else for me out there. Also, as I said earlier, I wanted to be an actor, so I had a focus. Even though I didn’t specifically know how I’d go about doing that, I did have a focus for my life. There were certainly a couple periods of my life where I could’ve gone one way, or the other. And thank God I went the other. Even during periods of my life when I was experiencing a kind of hopelessness, I always had the dream of being an actor, in addition to being encouraged.
Did your mother encourage you?
Well…my Moms didn’t raise me in the classic sense. However, she instilled enough in me that I had a sense that there was something substantial for me in life, there was a direction I could take in life.
Who did raise you?
My Moms did some, and I also went to live with a family that were friends of my mother’s, she was a nurse, and was at that time studying and they wouldn’t allow her to have a young child with her, so I went to live with these friends of hers. It’s an interesting question for me to contemplate: why did my life go in one direction rather than another. I really think the combination of self-belief, which of course doesn’t mean I’m not insecure or neurotic about myself, but there was enough belief in self that I felt there was something for me in my life, and I think as we know, the problem with a lot of the people who wind up being incarcerated is that they share a feeling of hopelessness, with nothing on the horizon except something that is destructive.
Get Shorty is another favorite film of mine that you did.
That was a very interesting moment in my career, because I think it introduced me to Hollywood in a more formal way. I was no longer the “Spike Lee actor,” I was now doing a bonafide, big budget, Hollywood studio film. Barry Sonnenfeld was great. He’s a very funny man and had a very specific idea of what he wanted. He kept saying “Just talk fast! Talk fast!” It was great material, and when I read the book, it made sense why the script was so good, but Scott Frank still did a wonderful job adapting it and capturing the book’s essence. I loved playing that character. It was a great time.
Any final thoughts on Medal of Honor Rag?
Tom Cole is coming out here for the opening, so I’ll be really curious to see how he responds to it. One of the producers in the last couple days has forwarded me emails from Vietnam vets who have seen the play and have been very affected by it, which is very, very gratifying. And I have to say this: because of the content of the play, Vietnam vets may be touched by it, but this work is still very much a work in progress as far as I’m concerned. There’s still a lot of areas I want to improve, so I don’t want to get lulled into a false sense of security by the fact that audiences are coming and seem to be liking it. While that’s very gratifying, I’m looking at the work that I have fairly specific ideas about that still needs to be worked on. The great thing is that I’m surrounded by people who are very excited about continuing to work on the material and fleshing it out as much as possible.
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